[00:00:01] Speaker A: Not just the body. You gotta work. You gotta work the mind and you gotta work the spirit. Because I know a lot of the times when my body feels broken, I have to tap into, like, my spirit. Like, I start praying and, like, I don't know how I get this energy, but I always get this reserve that I didn't even know I have. And I just know it's there.
[00:00:23] Speaker B: Hey there, it's Ramsay here. That was my guest, new friend, Jose Ramirez. We had a great discussion about training for and surviving ultra running. The connections between mind, body and spirit, and how running can be either blissful or painful, or maybe both. We also talked a bit about our faith and the importance of building meaningful relationships. So here we go.
[00:00:46] Speaker C: Jose, you and I have recently become friends. We're getting to know each other, but to introduce you to our listeners, I understand that you are husband, father, catholic believer, concrete slinger and ultra runner. So let's start with that last one on the list.
You like to run great distances. You run ultra marathons and you are currently preparing to run a 200 miles endurance race in a couple of months. Is that right?
[00:01:20] Speaker A: Yeah. So, yep, it's gonna be in August.
It's a point to point, 209 miles, I believe, 46,000ft of elevation gain. And it's probably the. The toughest thing I've set out to do in my life, and I am looking forward to it. I want to see what happens. Right. That's.
[00:01:46] Speaker C: That just sounds incredible to me. And I have to. I have to start with a very simple and very profound question. Why?
Why would you want to do that? I think most people would hear that and be like, you want me to do what now?
So, like, why? What drives you to do that?
[00:02:06] Speaker A: Well, you know what? I think that's just something that I've kind of came up with in the last, maybe two or three years. But in the beginning, when I started running, I wasn't running to even run a marathon. I've actually never ran a marathon yet, and I went straight into ultra marathons. And.
[00:02:29] Speaker C: So what kind of distance? What would be, like, the longest distance that you've run so far ever?
[00:02:35] Speaker A: 100 miles.
100 miles.
[00:02:38] Speaker C: Okay, so you just skipped, you know, 20 something marathon. Mile marathons.
[00:02:43] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, but, yeah, but you asked why? But for me, it's like, I think at one point I actually thought it was baloney. Like, how could somebody ever do that? You know, I never.
I thought it was like, nobody can run like that. That's. That's ridiculous. But the more I looked into it, I was like, wow, there's a. There's a community out there in this. In this world, that very small percentage of this population around the world that. That do these crazy things. And, you know, I was running. Maybe I started running by, like, running a mile or two. And, I mean, I was. I was so exhausted after that. This was like, five years ago. And.
And now that I started thinking and entertaining the thought that I could. That I can, if I just work at it just like anything, like, if I could just get myself healthy, get my weight at a certain weight, get myself mentally prepared, get my body prepared. Let's see if I could do a 50k, which is a 32 miles race. And that's. That was the first ultra marathon I did. And I got to tell you.
[00:03:58] Speaker C: How did that go?
[00:04:00] Speaker A: That was a very tough race. It really beat me up. And I went there pretty ill prepared. I did not go as well as I thought it was gonna go. I was running a lot of flats and a lot of flat trail. I wasn't running a lot of elevation. And when I showed up to that race, and, I mean, within the first 15 miles, my wife saw me at eight station. She's like, you look like you're deer in the headlights.
Right, right. You know, and it's like, it's. It's.
It's something that I think anybody could really do if you just actually just put your mind into the thought of, like, am I capable of this? I think everybody's capable of long distance running. It's all about just actually not letting that doubt sprout on your mind. Because after that race, even though I got really destroyed and thought, like, maybe I shouldn't even be here, I shouldn't be doing this. This is ridiculous. I told myself no, like, I just didn't prepare well. And, you know, I went on to just keep training and do the best I can, and I completed a couple other ultra marathons after that.
[00:05:12] Speaker C: Wow. So what is that like? I mean, what is the experience like, running that far? You said that the first time, you know, it was really difficult.
And now that you've got some experience, you've done some other ones. Like, what is that like, you know, during the race itself, like, how do you keep going? What? Like, what's that experience like for you?
[00:05:34] Speaker A: I think if you train properly, it could be a very blissful experience.
But even there's just so many variables to these races that, like, it could be blissful for the first 25 miles on a 50 miles race, and then it could be just miserable and painful the last 25 miles, maybe because you weren't hydrating enough. Maybe you're just sweating a little more than you think you are and you're draining your liquids faster than you are. It's. There's a lot of variables, and, like, everybody's a little different. And like I said, it could be blissful, but it could also be very painful. And it's. And I think a lot of it has to do with preparation and then also just really getting to know what your body is, like, doing through these races. Like, how does your body suffer? Like, you need to. You need to recognize the signs of, like, when you feel depleted, when you feel dehydrated, because a lot of the times, a lot of us are stubborn, and we're just like, oh, no, I'm okay, and then tell you, crash and burn, you know?
[00:06:37] Speaker C: Right, right. Well, I like to run a little bit. I like to run maybe five or 6 miles at a time. That takes about an hour.
So I kind of know what you're talking about when you say it can be blissful.
But tell me what you mean by that. Like, describe to me how it is blissful. What does that mean?
[00:07:03] Speaker A: I think blissful is you're kind of. It almost feels like you're on an idle, idle pilot. Like, you're. Do you know, have you ever had an experience, whether you've been in love with a girlfriend, your wife, when your kid's born, this, like, blissful experience of, like, feeling so happy because of, like, what you're just. What's presented right in front of you. And it's like, if you. I think if you practice gratitude, these experiences, even if they might be painful towards the end, could be, like, full of just this gracious and so much grace and so much gratitude behind all of it. And I think that's something, that's a tool that I take in my pocket every time I go race because I gravitate towards gratitude, because I tell myself, well, there's a lot of people that can't run, and I should be thankful for this. So I'm going to do. I'm going to run for everybody who can't run right now. And, I mean, there's so many ways of pulling out energy when you feel like you don't, because a lot of the times, it's just your gauge and your mentality in a race. When you. When you feel like you don't have any more energy, it's. It's probably because you're just starting to doubt a lot of the time yeah.
[00:08:28] Speaker C: Well, I hear you talk about that, that blissful state, and I think it's partly. Partly physical, partly mental, partly spiritual.
I think people sometimes call that the flow state where you are, you know, in a physical exercise where you're in a rhythm, your body's performing at or near full capacity. You know, you've got blood flow, you've got oxygen flow, and you're not tired yet. And it just feels great like that. That's like the middle of a run for me.
[00:09:05] Speaker A: It almost feels effortless when blissful. For me, blissful feels almost effortless. I mean, it's not completely effortless, but it feels effortless when you're actually on that flow state, and it feels amazing.
[00:09:19] Speaker C: Yeah. And you're just sort of floating along. You're going with the flow, you're, you're going with it. And I find that, um, that goes for me to have, like, I have some of the best, um, thoughts and, like, I like to work out problems while I'm running, and I like to, uh, listen to podcasts when I'm running or to pray. Um, and, you know, that time, I. I find that it seems like my mind and my spirit work just as well as my body is. Um, but then, you know, uh, you do get to a place where you start getting tired, and then you start sort of, you know, that, that bubble bursts, I think.
And so talk to me about how when you're running that far, you were starting to talk about it. Like, how do you sort of know when you're reaching that stage? How do you put it off? You know, how do you find other reserves?
How do you eat or drink while you're running that far? Because you're talking about running hours and days for the kind of runs that you do. So tell me more about how to keep going.
[00:10:33] Speaker A: Yeah, definitely. Just a bit in a perspective, I think, on my, my hundred mile race that I did last year, I think I burnt, like, 12,000 calories on the Horace. And so, like, I mean, that's, that's, that's like four days of calories for me. You know, saying, like, four, four and a half days of calories and just.
[00:10:50] Speaker C: Well, that's like six, cat. That's six days of calories according to the USDA, like, nutrition labels or whatever it is on the box of my cereal.
[00:10:59] Speaker A: Right.
But, yeah, it's insane. It's so much. So much calories you're taking in. But, you know, when you're talking about, like, when do you know? And how do you pull out these reserves. I think a lot, like, like we're talking about, it's mind, body and soul. And I mean, I feel like we all start with our body and then it turns into, like, the mind. And I feel like all these are like, I know the mind is not actually like a muscle, but I consider it a muscle because it's something you got to work as well, not just the body. You gotta work. You gotta work the mind and you gotta work the spirit. Because I know a lot of the times when my body feels broken, I have to tap into, like, my spirit. Like, I start praying and, like, I don't know how I get this energy, but I always get this reserve that I didn't even know I have. And I just know it's there.
And a lot of the time it could just be a chant. Like you're chanting a prayer in your mind over and over.
You're, you know, telling yourself something positive. And eventually that, that, that positive talk kind of turns in itself and turns into this energy that the body feeds off of. I mean, there's just so many things that I think that the body, mind and spirit, soul, they're all just interconnected. And I think this race really just, it's not a test of your body. It's a really a test of every aspect of your life. And like I've told many of my friends, it's like when you race 100 miles race, it's, you're living like a full lifetime of emotions and compressed into like a 24, 30 hours window in your life because, I mean, you could go from 1st, 20 miles, you're, you're the happiest guy. Just like, just like when you just have your first kid or your second kid, whatever kid, you know, you're happy. You're married first. When you get married, all these little, like, I like to, like, compare them because it's like, yeah, the first 20 miles is like the best part of your life. And then, like, the middle is like all the trials and tribulations you go through. Yeah.
[00:13:13] Speaker C: You're changing diapers at that point in the middle of the race, right, exactly.
[00:13:17] Speaker A: I mean, you're changing diapers and I mean, you know, we. And then there's hardships, right? Like nothing's ever perfect. You know, you get into, I get arguments with my wife or just misunderstanding with a friend or a family member. And like that, that's the middle, the race, right. All these, like, problems and, like the end of the race could also turn into like, a really hard, like, I don't know, you get diagnosed with something or something really drastic happens or, like, something drastic happens, but then all of a sudden, you know, you fight it, you win it, and now you're at the end, and you're just your hands. You have your hands up, and even though you're beat up, you. You. You've gotten to the end of your life, quote, unquote, unquote the race, and you feel. You feel good. You know, it's almost like you're living a life in a very compressed time frame. I like to. I like to.
That is described that way.
[00:14:19] Speaker C: Profound. That is really profound.
And do you find that the experiences that you've had running have translated into other aspects of your life? You know, does that achievement that you've had with your running, does that carry over and give you confidence or perspective on to sort of the actual things happening in your life? And what is that like?
[00:14:47] Speaker A: Oh, definitely.
I think it makes me just more gracious and more like, I'll keep repeating gratitude as we're talking along because I think that's, like, probably one of the most important things and one of the most important things that people lack in their lives. We go around our lives taking a lot of things for granted, and we need to appreciate the little things that our feet, our legs, our breath, our heartbeat, our vision, all these little things are so important, I think, to to life. And to me, running brings so much of that. Like, I finish a race, and when I see my daughters when I get home from a race or they're at the race, sometimes I am so happy to see them. I'm just like, I am so happy you're alive. Like, it's the feelings of emotions that I get.
[00:15:40] Speaker C: I'm happy I'm alive, too, but I'm happy that you're here.
[00:15:44] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, man, it's all that. All of it, man. It's so cool. It's like that. The best feeling in the world, you know? And I think that's what gets. Got. Gets me hooked. Like, there's some kind of, I don't know, serotonin, dopamine that's released at the end of a race that's like. That really sucked. But I feel really good right now, even though my body feels like crap.
[00:16:06] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah, that. That is. That is incredible stuff.
So you do a lot of this running you must on trails. You do a lot of trail running, right? Do you have a love for the outdoors? Is that part of it, too, that you get to go out and be outside?
[00:16:25] Speaker A: Yeah, I think. I think for me, it's.
I keep saying it a lot, and I think being outdoors is. It's my way of, like, connecting with God.
Yeah. And that's my, that's my feel, and that's what I like, that's what I take with me when I'm out there. I feel like I'm taught I'm there with him. That's, that's what I'm doing out there. I'm alone a lot of the times I do run with a couple of different friends, but when I do go alone, I think I appreciate it even more because I am actually in tune with, with, you know, our creator, and I'm, I'm constantly talking to him and thanking him and just showing appreciation. And I think for me, just like in the, in the story of Moses, how he goes up to the mountain to talk to God, I mean, I feel like I'm. When I do that, I'm like, that's what I'm doing. You know, I'm going to the mountain to talk to God. I'm also training and I'm doing a lot of these other things. I love the outdoors. I love the views and everything, but I feel like that's all because of God. And that's what I'm there. I'm there to, like, show some gratitude for that.
[00:17:40] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah, that's really great.
For sure. You've mentioned gratitude a bunch of times.
You know, being thankful for, you know, the strength in your body and for what you have and, you know, the abilities and just, you know, for, even for the trails that you have to run on. And, you know, we're out here in Washington state. We've got some, some beautiful, some beautiful.
[00:18:11] Speaker A: Country oranges out here.
[00:18:14] Speaker C: Yeah. And I think a lot of people, too, connect with God through nature, and that's something really terrific.
You know, I'm really interested in.
Well, I'm interested in a bunch of things, but fitness and health is definitely one of sort of the big topics.
And so I have to think as a baseline that if you're able to get out and run like that, that you have to be fit and healthy. But sort of, how do you, how do you actively try to stay fit and healthy kind of in your everyday life? And, you know, how, how successful are you at that?
[00:18:54] Speaker A: You know, it's, it's, it's kind of a sore subject. Cause I, I am pretty healthy, like, for the most part, but I do fall into, like, dips throughout the year where I'm just not caring of what I'm taking in. And I, and I suffer for that because when I start preparing for a race, then all of a sudden I got all this weight that I need to cut, cut off, you know, shed off so I could perform at my, my maximum effort. And it's like, it's not easy, you know, especially, you know, I have a family. I run a business.
I'm a concrete guy. So it's like, a lot of the times when I'm pouring concrete, I am burning just as much calories when I go to work pouring concrete all day, as much as if I want to go run it like a marathon, you know? So it's. I have a hard time sometimes. Like, on days like that, I'll purposely not, not even run. A lot of the times I'll maybe just get on my stationary bike because it's more low impact and it's less strenuous on my back. I've been bent over all day as, like, my back sore. So it's like I'll get on a stationary bike, but I have a hard time sometimes. I'm not going to lie to you. I have a hard time even eating healthy, like, when I'm at work because I'm just trying to get something on the fly, but something that I've been implementing when I do start training for races that I meal prep. I meal prep meals to take with me to work and then, so I don't even get that temptation to go get a crappy meal from some fast food joint or, yeah, diner or, you know, whatever, because I start really paying it, paying attention what I'm taking in, because just like a race car, you know, you, you want to be, you want to be feeding the race car good fuel, not bad fuel. Right. So that's, that's, that's kind of how it goes, you know? But as soon as I get just, it really depends on what, how far I'm out from a race. But a lot of the times I'll, I'll base up my race.
Basically what I mean by that is I'll build a base of fitness and I will build the base of fitness. And from there, it's like, I'm not in shape for a race there, but I'm actually, I get in shape to start training for the race if, you know.
[00:21:17] Speaker C: Yeah, well, you have to, you have to keep a strong baseline. Right. Because you can't go, you know, completely to seed, if you will.
[00:21:25] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:25] Speaker C: You get to come all the way back.
[00:21:27] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. So it's like I'm actually in right now. I'm in that position right now. I just started kind of like, unfortunately, I got like, sick twice this year already and that was a couple little setbacks that I had. But I'm still good. I'm in, I'm in decent base shape and I'm just starting to train. I'm like about 1918 weeks out and I think this is a perfect time. And I'll probably peak my fitness around like the second week of July. 1 week of July. And then I'll slowly taper. I'll still be training kind of hard, but not. I'd be taking it easy and real easy the week out ahead of the race.
[00:22:08] Speaker C: Yeah.
Well, good.
What else, what else would you like to talk about? Do you have thoughts, ideas, things you wanted to talk about or questions for me, like, where should we, where would you like to go from here?
[00:22:25] Speaker A: You know, maybe our faith.
I mean, what's your history like? How did you got introduced to God and our Lord and savior Jesus Christ? How did you get, did you grow up a Christian? Did you find it later in life?
How did that go for you?
[00:22:52] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. It was actually in my twenties, so I have a jewish heritage. Growing up, my family was not kind of super religious in the home.
Then when I was in college and after college got married, my wife and I moved out to Michigan and started going to this little church. We got a postcard in the mail that had some people hiking on it, and that really appealed to my wife. And I flipped the postcard over and it said that the local radio station was going to be playing at it. So I was like, hey, you know, rock 103 or whatever is going to be there, so why not go and get a free frisbee at the, at the kickoff of the church? And so I was there and I went for a few weeks and, you know, my wife was much more into it. And, you know, for a year or so, she was kind of really interested, and I was kind of just sort of not paying close attention. But, you know, I started listening to this book on tape of the greatest story ever told, which is like the novelization of Jesus's life. Of course I'm dating myself because I just said book on tape, but legit. It was a book on cassette tape. I was driving to work on a regular basis, so I'm like, listening to this book and answering questions. I have lots of questions. Being jewish about could I be jewish and a Christian at the same time. Of course, you know, Jesus was a jew and so were all of his followers at that time. You know, his disciples. And so I had lots of questions, but I was really sort of coming around. And really everything that I learned about him was something that appealed to me. And then, you know, I was kind of really coming around. And one day we went to. We went to the video store, dating myself again to rent a movie. And we're walking. I just walked through a random, random aisle, and there on the shelf is the greatest story ever told, you know, the movie version of it. And I'm like, oh, okay. But I don't get it. I just keep walking. I didn't know there was a movie version of it. They've been made, you know, 20 years before that or whatever, like probably Charlton Heston or somebody like that.
But we went and we just got whatever new release there was.
And so we got that, took it home, we popped it in, and, you know, they have previews at the beginning of the tape, and one of the previews was the greatest story ever told right there in front of me. And my wife is like, isn't that the book that you're listening to? It's like, yeah, it kind of is.
And so I'm like, okay, I hear you. So, you know, went to church and after that, and so really sort of got into it. And that was more than, let's see, that was the early two thousands. So that was 20 years ago.
[00:26:24] Speaker A: So that had a big, profound influence on you.
[00:26:30] Speaker C: Yeah, the book was good because it really sort of was available and sort of spoke to me in ways that I could. That I could receive and that sort of thing, instead of.
I guess I respond that better that way than to just, like, extensive study.
But how about you?
What has your experience been like?
[00:26:56] Speaker A: Oh, so I'm a born. I'm the cradle Catholic. I was born a Catholic. And I grew up just having my mother constantly taking me to church with my siblings. And, you know, a lot of the. For a lot, I feel like a lot of my youth, I just didn't care so much about it. And I think. I think it just into my later. Later in my twenties, when I had children or with my second wife, I had children.
It's when I really started, I was just dealing with a lot of, like, depression and anxiety. And I had lost the son to a divorce. And there's just a lot of things that happened in my past that were just kind of lingering inside and just twisting me up a lot. It's like I'm doing. I'm doing all these things. I'm doing a lot of things that are just not working right. And it's like, I need, like, I need. I don't know what I'm missing, but I'm missing something. And my mother just kept praying for me and telling me, like, I think you need to, like, go to church. And she's like, I don't mean, like, just go to church, but, like. Like, be with God. Like, talk to him, pray, like, do whatever it takes. Good. You know? And then that's something that I took into consideration. But I never really pulled the plug until, like, I was in my thirties, you know, I was married at the St. Michael's church here in town with my current wife. And even then, I still wasn't. Like I was. We would go to church, you know, you know, handful of times a year, especially this special, like, easter and stuff, but, uh, never take it very serious. But something I really want to, like, take very serious now. And, um. And I'm. That's probably the part of my life that I feel like I've been lacking a lot. And it's. It's a part of my life that I think it's the biggest priority now, um, alongside my family that I'm raising. And, uh, I think it's been a profound impact, especially, uh, this group that we've been part of and, um, just. Just the disciplines that we've had to, like, accomplish through these last 90 days. They're about to be up and. Yeah, they've been. They've been great.
[00:29:14] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, we've been. We've been doing the Exodus 90 protocol. I don't know what to call it.
[00:29:25] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:29:25] Speaker C: But, yeah, it's. It's been quite an experience. We've. These first few months of the year leading up to Easter, we've systematically given up a bunch of stuff and systematically added a bunch of stuff in order to really sort of get our priorities straight and, you know, be healthy and pointed towards God and to really sort of.
And it's been nice because we've done it with a group of guys and have gotten to know each other really well.
[00:29:57] Speaker A: So, yeah, it's been great. I think that. I think that's something also, that we, as men, we lack is a brotherhood. Like, a brotherhood, you know, like, I've. I was, like, I was. I was reading something a couple weeks back where they were talking about, like, you have three. Three types of friends. You got. You got your childhood friends, you got your business friends, and then you got your virtuous friends. And I think, like, everybody lacks virtuous friends, you know, friends that are connected to God or want to be connected to God, and they want to share their story with you. And in that, there's a lot of healing that's being developed within the camaraderie and the brotherhood. And I think that's, like, such an important thing, especially when it comes to, like, mental health. I feel like that's where men's mental health is, is at its best.
When there's a brotherhood and you have somebody you could confine and be like, hey, you know, this is, this happened. I don't feel good and, and not feel like you're gonna be shamed for it, you know, definitely a great, great group of guys that we've been talking to.
[00:31:12] Speaker C: Well, I think it is. I think it's powerful, and I think it's difficult to find sometimes a group of friends that you can be real with and that you can sort of be vulnerable with and talk about real things with and sort of work through challenges and all be really focused on improvement, you know, and be there for each other and also to be there to kind of work on ourselves and realize that, you know, everybody has things that they're good at and that they're, they're working, that are working well and that everybody has their stuff to deal with and all of their challenges and finding a place and a time to really be real and work through some of that stuff is really precious, and I think we're blessed to have that. Not everybody has a chance to do that. And, you know, whether it's done through a faith based context or whether it's done through, you know, just close friendships that, you know, don't necessarily have to do with faith, but just, you know, people connecting with each other in a real way, I think, you know, those are both really strong and really powerful.
You know, life today, it's such a, it's such a paradox because in some ways, we're so completely connected. Like we have devices and electronics and emails and, you know, you can be on a Zoom meeting with people from all over the country or the world or whatever all the same time. But at the same time, it feels like this technology also isolates us because we have this screen or this microphone or the speaker in between.
[00:33:11] Speaker A: So that's a big disconnect. Yeah.
[00:33:15] Speaker C: This, uh, this podcast is called what's worthwhile? So I have to ask, what do you think is worthwhile? So worth your time, worth your attention, worth your consideration, you know, kind of in your life or in general?
[00:33:34] Speaker A: I'm probably going to miss a couple things, but just from the top of my head, I think, I think a lot of things that are worthwhile are just relationships. I think that's probably the most worthwhile thing that we all could have and appreciate. I think a lot of the times we'll, when we start getting together and getting to meet somebody, we will focus on maybe one negative thing that this person said or maybe you don't agree with this type of lifestyle, but then this big chunk of life over here, like that they have like really correlates with your life. But because of this one little thing, it's like, I think it's so important that we like, that we like give each other always chances and, and talk things through. Because relationships make everything worthwhile, man. Like, everything. I think when it comes to relationships with, you know, work, brotherhoods, like we were talking about within our family, I feel like relationships are probably the most worthwhile thing for me. And of course, having God within all of that and in the middle of it is definitely the thing to do.
[00:34:55] Speaker C: So true.
Relationships are really key.
And another thing that I'm really interested in just in general, is bridge, building, building bridges between people. Especially people who, uh, you know, wouldn't necessarily, uh, think that they have that much in common. So, uh, people that are really different from each other or that think differently or they come from different backgrounds. Um, it just seems like the world, uh, wants us to all be fighting with each other instead of sort of uh, making peace and understanding. And you're right, I think it's the individual one on one relationships that people can build with people, especially people who are, you know, not like them.
[00:35:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:35:50] Speaker C: You know, those are, those are going to be the solutions that, that can solve things.
[00:35:56] Speaker A: Yeah. I really think, like making, creating relationships with people that you think that are, have nothing in common with, you probably are the most fruitful because you, that's where you get to learn. Like, you know, and for me, it's always been like, even when it comes to my fitness, like, I like to run with stronger runners, slower runners, it doesn't matter. Like what kind of, I'm trying to like have analogy here because you learn, you learn different things from each type of runner, right? And it's like, I think it's in relationship and relationships, it's the same kind of concept. Like, you should never think you're just, you're above somebody because of this or that. Because I feel like at the end of the day, everybody has something to learn from anybody and it's like so important. I think I feel like showing some humility in that type of way is very important to building relationships.
[00:36:58] Speaker C: Well, it's such a good point to, you know, try to find people who are a little bit better than you are at, you know, things, you know, in particular. So, you know, running with a stronger runner, you know, or finding mentors.
But then that, but in order for that to work, you also have to be ready and willing to be a mentor yourself and to, you know, have, take newer runners under your wing and bring them along. So, you know, those things really work together, I think. And, you know, you get to sort of mutual, mutual assistance. And you're surprised. I think we're surprised, too, a lot of times what people have to offer that we never would have guessed that that person had anything to offer, but we would have missed it if we didn't open ourselves up and, and get to know them.
[00:37:59] Speaker A: Absolutely. I agree. That's, yep, that's, I think, I think at our core, we're all trying to find the perfect friend, but I think the perfect friend doesn't exist. Right. Like, I think it's so important that we are, we make ourselves the best versions of ourselves so we're able to conjoin with others. And, you know, at some point when you become a really good friend with somebody, you could be vulnerable with them. And I feel like that's also a very powerful healing part of life.
When I talk about building relationships, I think your brotherhood, your friends, the people that you can find, those are the people that are going to be coming to your rescue when it comes to any type of situation. Right? So I think it's, and then as well, you become the rescuer for the friend that's struggling with any type of situation in their life.
[00:39:03] Speaker C: So true.
Well, Jose, thank you so much. I so appreciate you taking the time to have this conversation. I've really been looking forward to it. And let's talk again soon.
[00:39:16] Speaker A: Definitely. Ramsey, thank you. Yeah, that was great. Thanks.
[00:39:19] Speaker C: Absolutely.
[00:39:21] Speaker B: Thank you for asking. What's worthwhile? Visit whatsworthwhile.net to learn more about me, Ramsay Zimmerman, and please provide your name and email to become a supporter. I'm asking for prayer, advice, feedback and connections. The what's Worthwhile podcast is on Spotify, Apple, iHeart, and Amazon. You can also
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